Hi. We're here with Grace Chon, um, my spiritual running partner, Bestie Girl, who we met on Twitter.  Did we meet on Twitter? I think I did. I don't even remember that. You have a much better, better memory of this. Here's, here's the breakdown. I was on Twitter and this was back when I used to work with my husband.

We were a photography team and so I was like all up in the branding and marketing and the publicity. Publicizing of this thing. And so I found you on Twitter and I just really vibed with your energy and I loved your branding and I checked out your photography and I could just feel you through the pictures.

I didn't, you know, no, I didn't know back then that I was like tuning in at all. I didn't know that I was picking up on your energy or your vibe or anything, but now we know that that's what we were doing. But anyway, I reached out to you and I was like, hi, I really like your work. I think your branding is incredible.

I really pictures. That's so cool. And we just started talking and  here we are. Oh my gosh. Do you remember what year that was?  Uh, I got, I want to say like 2011,  2012. Wow. We've been friends for so long. Yeah. That's amazing. And then, um,  cut to a whole like spiritual coming out of the closet. process for me where I decided, Oh my gosh, I'm going to start doing readings.

And actually, hi guys, I'm a psychic medium. I'm a psychic channel, and this is the work that I do. Surprise. And I decided to do, I think, 25  free readings just to get started. And you were the first Person who responded and the first reading that I did, you came over to my house, which is hilarious because living in the same city, it took us like six, seven years to actually get together in the same physical location.

Um, and you were the 1st, the 1st guinea pig and, um, that just meant so much to me that you believed in me and that you were willing to meet me there after having known each other in a totally different. context. So thank you for that. Oh my gosh. Thank you. I'm glad you've reached out. I just think it's so incredible what happens if you put yourself out there and try to make that connection, listen to your intuition, take those steps.

And I think it's such an honor that I was your very first psychic reading. That is so special. That's so special. Yeah. I, I, um, God, I remember being so nervous too. Like, um,  I had all my little crystals with me. I had them in my hand and at first nothing was coming and I was like, grace, I'll be right back.

I'm going to go in the other room and write a whole. I remember that part. I remember that.  I was like, okay, crystals, you got me, right? You got me. And so I was like, Ooh, I could do this. I got my crystals with me. It's no pressure. It's totally fine. And then of course, like stuff started coming in when I was able to like give myself a little bit of grace. 

Isn't it interesting, too, how like,  oh, well, it was a beautiful pun, well intended. Um, isn't it interesting, too, how like, the first time you do anything is so, like, scary? Yeah. Like, I bet you've never been that scared ever again doing a reading. Mm mm. Mm mm. It just felt so significant, like, this is the beginning of the next chapter.

I mean, it just, it really didn't need to be that significant, but I think it kind of Mm mm. Maybe was actually. It was a, it was a stepping into a new life, a new identity. Um,  yeah.  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What were you, what were you doing back then? Let's see. What year was  this? This is like 2018, 2017? 17, 18. Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. So by then I was just fully a commercial, um, Pet photographer. So when you first reached out to me back on Twitter, I was a retail pet photographer. So just the difference there is just the audience, who your clients are, right? And so I started out more like as a family pet photographer. Um, and as I kept Shine pet photos back then, right?

Yes. Good memory. It was called shine pet photos, which I just got chills because that word shine has been so significant in my journey. Like that word, um, Just resonates with me so deeply. It's been my like, AOL instant messenger name, screen name, Grace Shine. It was my first website for my art director portfolio.

And then it was the name of my business, Shine Pet Photos. And so, um, from there I transitioned to commercial pet photography. So now instead of like taking pictures for private clients, It's working with ad agencies and pet brands. So yeah, that's what I do now, among other, among other things. Yeah. Other things.

You are being very modest, my friend, having published books everywhere, having viral photo series go crazy globally, like no big deal, no big deal. And also now you're also a coach and you have your own podcast and you tune in for your clients and you do Akashic record readings. We're not going to be modest.

We're going to shine. Right? Right. Right. Oh, oh, thank you. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. I liked it. You know what I think? Like, I just like to do a lot of things and I think when something is interesting,  I don't want to like not try. It's fun. It makes sense. It is fun. It takes such courage and bravery to really step into doing something new and upsetting the apple cart in many ways.

Right.  For sure. And I think that we all come in with different gifts that are, that come a little easier to us than others. Right. And so for me, starting new things  is not hard, which now as a coach, and I work with people to really step into that power. and to alchemize their gifts and to create the things that they want to see in the world and to step into that territory.

That comes so naturally to me that, like, I think that's why now I'd be working with people with that. Does that make sense? A hundred percent. Because if I'm, if I'm coming in born with that and I've been using it for my whole life, to me, it would make sense then these gifts are going to be utilized.

Starting in college versus the people that I'm working with, though, are getting into this stage later in life. Right. And it's like, yeah, helping them along that journey. Yeah. And so doing that always came really easily to you?  I think so. Was that part of your upbringing or was that even upsetting the apple cart back then? 

I think I came into this world as an extremely rebellious spirit. I think, I think it's probably why for me, it feels like I was born into a very constrictive environment and I'm coming in extremely rebellious. And so at a young age, like I was always different. You know, I'm Asian in a very white neighborhood.

I'm, uh, very in a very conservative Christian. church where everyone's doing the same, you know, like Christianity to me, a lot of times the religion, the infrastructure of the religion, the dogma of the religion, as we know it, I'm not talking about Jesus Christ, but just religion. It can feel very like you're in a little bit of a box a little bit.

And, um, I grew up Presbyterian. It was a very legalistic church and it also had the Korean influence to it, which I'll get to in a second. So it felt very rigid. Legalistic means You're a good Christian if you follow these rules and if you don't follow these rules and you're gonna go to hell like yeah, and then Korean culture, uh, very conformist.

Everyone does the same thing. Everyone thinks the same way. And if you don't, you're different. And so I came into this container of a lot of, Conformity, a lot of rigidity, a lot of follow the rules. And my spirit is like fighting against that at every level. And so, you know, when you're young, you kind of go along with it.

Cause you sort of don't know any different. My parents were immigrants from Korea and so I'm doing what they're telling me. But by college is when I really started being like, Oh, like I can't, I'm not, this is not for me. I gotta break out of this. I can't do it.  Wow. So did it take you until college or did you start questioning even when it, when you were a little, I want to really zero in on like any moments that you might remember, like hearing the language, whether it be culturally or religion or spiritually that you were given to put everything into context  and getting to that moment of this language doesn't feel right.

This, this does, the concept doesn't fit the words that I've been given. Yeah. I think that, um,  something that comes to mind as you say that is just, um,  the performance aspect of things as it pertains to religion. So what that means is, you know, I grew up with this environment where if you sang the loudest, you raised your hand and cried the loudest.

If you got down on your knees and prayed the most, then you were the best Christian. And to me, the, the, Disconnect was like, I don't feel like I have to do what you're doing to prove my connection to God. Do you see what I mean by that rebelliousness though? I'm like, I see this stuff around me and I'm like, I don't need to do this show.

I don't want to do the show. So I think there's always just these like little seeds in me of  this is how people are doing things, but like, it doesn't sit right with me. And did that cause conflict in your family life? What did that look like? I think, um, you know, my parents were so supportive of me as a child.

I feel really blessed because they were really busy immigrants with the dry cleaner. They worked every single day from 7 a. m. to 7 p. m. They had one day off a week and that's when we went to church.  Yet somehow they were still able to see me when they were around. So it's like, I remember like being like four and just being able to like pluck out little, you don't like those kid books that have like a tiny keyboard with like 10 notes on it.

I'm like, I'm like a four year old like plucking out songs by ear on this tiny little toy thing attached to like a book. So it's not even like a toy piano. It's like a thing attached to a book. But it's like, And my parents see that and they're like, we got to get into piano lessons. Or like, you know, I was always really creative and artistic.

And so then they would get me into art class. And so I feel really fortunate. And maybe this is the seeds of me. Like if I'm interested in something, let me try it. Cause my parents sort of showed me that path. My dad was also so curious, like he had a gajillion hobbies. And so I could see modeled through him.

If you're interested in something, do it, spend your free time on it. And so I had that foundation, but very quickly, I would say by junior high school, it was like  those little hobbies where you're very artistic and creative. They're wonderful, but they're hobbies and you can't make money doing it. You have to study, get perfect grades, get a perfect SAT score so you can go to an Ivy league college.

That,  that it was like a mantra. I heard that over and over and over and over again. And so. It was like, I had this whole foundation of being really artistic, but then my parents were kind of like,  it's a cute hobby, Grace, can't make money with it though. So here's the transition. So you're allowed to play a child, but now it's time to get serious if you want to be successful in this world.

Interesting.  And so it's like, they gave you all the tools to be creative and have an intuition, but then said, okay, now time's up.  Basically. Yeah. Yeah. Time to get serious. Time to think about a job that's going to make you money. Yeah. Yeah.  Wow. Okay. So two paths to take this conversation on. I know that your dad has passed away and that has been a very foundational experience, obviously, but the relationship after that, creating your own  version of spirituality, your own path back to yourself and  concurrently.

Your path in your career, how you went that  formulaic path, you explored all of the shoulds and the have tos, and then you decided to break apart and break away. So  where would you like to go? Let's tune into where you want to go first. I think that's like such a great question because I often say, I think if my dad had not passed away, me breaking away and doing my own thing would have been a lot harder for me to do.

I think going against my father's wishes, cause I loved him. I was such a daddy's girl. And I think, you know,  I think, I think energetically we're really, really similar. We have very similar hobbies. So I was just naturally as a child into the things he was into. Like my top photography, my dad was a photographer, you know, I'm major into gardening.

He's into gardening. He loved flea markets. I'm still into flea markets. You know, he just, he loves music. All these things are very much a part of me today. And I think if he had not passed away, so he passed away when I was 13. And it was my senior year of college is when I started breaking away. And I think if he had not passed away, me deciding in college in my senior year and being like, I'm not doing this anymore, you guys.

I think he would have been like, no, no, no. Because he had really high expectations of me. So like, if I'm like, I want to be a teacher, he'd be like, oh yes, you can be a professor at Princeton.  He'd always take my like, little teeny childhood dream and like, make it like, so big, which I love that, but also it's like, I, it just such high expectations.

Right. And so, um, it was, Not that it was easy, but I rebelled against my mom. And like, uh, I just, I remember so clearly in college, uh, when I told her, okay, I got my bio degree. I'm going to go to art school now. And she was like, I forbid that. No, no, go to pharmacy school instead. And I said to her,  I love you.

I respect you, but I'm sorry. I'm not asking you for a dime. I'm going to pay my way through this, so I'm going. And that was it. Right? I don't think I could have stood up to my dad like that. And I know because I can communicate with him so clearly now, like he's so freaking proud of me  that I was able to like break through the rigidity and like really follow my heart and do what was right for me. 

Wow. That's incredible.  That actually really made me emotional because in. It's, it's like in a way, soul contract wise, soul level wise, it's like he knew  for you to fly as height as you came to fly. He had to get out of the way.  Yeah. I, I honestly think that he,  this was predetermined.  I mean, I don't know how, how, how, how deep you want to go in this, but, uh, Oh, soul level deep, my friend.

Yeah. Soul level deep. I think we had predetermined contracts. Like I wanted to come into this world to really, um, be able to serve at the depths of my heart.  And for that to happen, I had to have the greatest wounding of my life happen, which was for him to pass away. And so I think all of this happened where it was decided, okay, well then in this life, I'm going to die when you're 13 and let's see what happens.

I 

need a second, man. What a beautiful, heart wrenching agreement. 

Yeah. It's, um, not been, it's been a journey. So all of it's a journey, right? It's like, uh, it's a process of remembering, awakening. I really think we learn through the extremes of polarity and, you know, I could have very much kept my heart rigid  with his death. I could have very much. Stayed on the path of what my mom wanted me to do to be a pharmacist.

Oh my God, I'm so glad I'm not a pharmacist. Not to knock pharmacy. That's just not me. It's not me. It's not for me. And so I think that is the journey of our souls. It's  to do  that. I think this is why like we, we say things like  when something scares you, there's something on the other side of it. When there's resistance.

There's something on the other side of that is because of this exact journey that I'm talking about. Right. And it really comes down to choice and free will, because you had the choice. Like you said, to become a rigid, fearful,  formulaic person, the way that you had been taught on many levels, right? But it's like you,  the wisdom, the courage, the presence of mind and heart to listen to that feeling that, no, there's more for me,  and if I could just trust it, and I think if I could just keep going,  I don't have to know what it is.

But there's something  so scary for people and again, I think that  we are all on such different journeys, right? And so I can see how this rebelliousness,  the structure I was born into, um, You know, it gave me the courage to start making these steps like really early on in my life.  Um,  I've lost my train of thought.

I'm sorry. It connected to what you were saying, but basically scary  for people. Yeah. I think it's very scary to do that and you have to trust. And I think when I was younger, I remember now, like when I was doing this in my twenties, I didn't know that's what I was doing. Hmm. I didn't know I was listening to my intuition.

I didn't know I was listening to my soul. Do you know what I'm saying? Would you say that that was helpful in that context of you not to make it this big huge thing? It's just doing what felt right?  Yeah. I think at the time, what it really felt like for me was I just need to do what's right for me and stop trying to put me in a box.

That's what it felt like. Yeah. It's as I kept growing in my own maturity, understanding, wisdom,  my own spiritual practice is when I could really see, wow, I was really leaning into listening to my intuition more than the external world. And for whatever reason, it's again, it's those structures I was born into.

It's like I had this perfect melting pot of, and that rebellious spirit, I'm a life path five, fives are rebels. So I came in with a very rebellious energy anyway. You know, it put into this perfect container to rebel against.  And so I'm doing that in my 20s, not even realizing, Oh, this is me listening to my intuition.

This is me listening to the guidance of my soul. It really just felt like, stop trying to put me in a box. I want to do this. It really felt more like you've told me my whole life. I can't be creative and make money at it. Well, let me show you.  And that's what that journey felt like. So even when I got to art school, I had, you know, professors.

at school telling me I couldn't do it, that I didn't have the chops. I had a teacher tell me, you're not creative. You should be a producer. You should, you should go be a producer. So it's funny that you started this conversation saying, oh, Grace, don't be so humble. You've gone viral. You've held these books.

Like I had somebody tell me you're not creative. Right. And then I've had like photo series go viral globally around the world, get turned into books and then my, um, yeah, the Dean of my department, even at, we have something called a midpoint review where they kind of like assess where you are and kind of like tell you what you need to do to graduate.

And she basically, It was like,  you got to step it up, like you're not, you're, you're not cutting it girlfriend.  Yeah. And so when these obstacles, all of these points of contact where you could have been like, you're right, nevermind. Right. And there's something in my soul design that some rebellious fire. I have a lot of fire energy, something in me.

When someone tells me that I go. Let me prove you wrong versus let me go shrink and hide. You're right. I don't know what that is I can't tell you what that is except that there's something deep within me and I think that's why it to me From a very high level now, it would make sense that I am helping people do the things they want to do when deep inside they're telling themselves they can't do it.

Cause I'm like, yes, you fucking can. You can do it. They get to borrow your aura and your fire and your strength for a little bit. That's really cool. Maybe so. Yeah. It's like you have so much of it. You have an overflow to share. I love that. I love that too. So I want to transition way crazy segue right now, but you said something about Your spiritual practice and how your muscles basically got so much bigger and your clarity got so much stronger once you were able to implement those tools on purpose.

And so I would love to know what does your spiritual practice look like now and has it evolved as you've, you know, grown in your career as you've become a mom. All of that. Yeah, it's definitely, it's always evolving. It's like, um, what do they call it? It's like that lotus that's blossoming. I don't think, this is what I find so fun about growth, spirituality, is it's infinite.

You never reach an ending point unless like you're here as an ascended master. Like, I just think it's so fun to know your growth is infinite. Your potential is infinite. And so, um, I think this is what happened. I grew up, like I said, very Christian.  And I think what that gave me was this incredible foundation to know what it feels like to have a connection with source energy.

I like to use the word God. I mean, I, I love, I love God so much. My life is in devotion and expression of God.  Um, and again, I don't need that in the Christian context, but really my connection with source energy, it is the strongest connection that I have. And everything I do and create is an expression of that relationship that I have.

And so that, that though has evolved, like all of this is just this constant evolution. And so, um, I would say the biggest shift that happened for me was probably around, I think it was like 2021  when my guides were like, Um, become an Akashic record reader and I was like, what? Because I got certified in that like before the pandemic in 2019, just because it's something I've always been curious about.

Um, and it was purely for myself, right? I'm a photographer. This is like purely for myself. Um, but by 2021. I got this nudge and they were like, okay, you remember that whole Akashic Records thing you did? Um, go do some readings for some good friends. And I was like, okay, sure. And so I went and I did it with good friends and then they were like, okay, now go do it with some acquaintances.

And I was like, okay. I'll do it. And so I did it with some acquaintances and then they were like, okay, now we want you to do with people you don't even know at all. I was like, okay, I'll do it. And I was doing readings for people like in other countries. Um, and then when I did that after that, they were like, okay, now we want you to do readings and get paid.

And I'm like, okay, I'll do it. And so I kept just being like, okay,  okay, I'll do it. Cause I think by that point, this is like 2021. Like  I could see so clearly through the journey of my life. Like if you get the nudge. It's really important that you follow through on it. And so, that accelerated everything exponentially, because when I started doing readings for people, now I am getting tangible validation and evidence from somebody else that what I'm getting is for real.

Like, I'm getting information that I Karen of made up I'm getting people's passed away grandmas and parents coming through like I'm just getting all this stuff Like I could have never known that Changed everything for me because that's when it made me realize. Okay from this point on  I will do whatever That I can You are telling me to do.

I call it like I made my vow of intuitive obedience that started in  2021, I think, and it hasn't stopped since. And I think I got to this point in my journey where now it's like, I'm just living life in the flow of this relationship that it made this relationship that I have so much realer.  When you have someone else validating that, right?

And so now I just do whatever it is they tell me to do. And I'm like, it's such a amazing, fun, freeing way to live. Like I'm not, of course, when they tell me things, it's still scary. I'm still human. I'm going to have a human emotional response to it. But  once that initial, like, Oh my God, that's so scary.

Like that passes, then it's like, wow, I know this is leading me to like exactly where I'm supposed to be going.  That's incredible. And obviously I know you, so I know the context of that whole story. And I know that it hasn't always come as easily  as it sounds. Now it now it's, it's the experience of the embodied alignment, right?

It doesn't sound like you rely so much on the rituals and the lighting of the candles and the 20 minutes of prayer. And. Life is too busy for it. We don't have time. So I love how you've gotten to a place, which I love. I love living from this place where it's just. Part of the air that you breathe. Yeah.

In just like basic decision making as you go. It's just, it's like an app running in the background. At least that's what it feels like for me. It's just always there. Um, I feel like my life is my spiritual practice, my day to day life and my engagement with the people in my life, my community. Um, you know, my podcast listeners, my social media people, like all of even just, I walk for an hour to an hour and a half every day.

And like, that is a spiritual practice, you know, like I'm breathing in the energy of the flowers and the plants and I'm just seeing animals like that is my, like, I just feel like life is my spiritual practice. Also motherhood is a great spiritual practice. Yeah. So. I realized, um, you know, since I've been doing this walking thing every day, like I, I haven't been sitting and meditating as much because that is my meditation.

Mm hmm. And I mean, the walking meditation is a completely valid practice, but it's interesting how it's almost like we  maybe as a society are almost married to the idea that everything needs to have effort, that it needs to be,  if it, if it's going to count, if it's.  You know, valid at all. It needs to be effortful.

It needs to be this  thing, this ritual, this  almost tangible thing that you're doing, but it really doesn't. It's, it's the whole point of it all, which is the next step, the integration of everything. You don't have to go to the retreat and the ayahuasca and the whatever. To reach enlightenment or to, to tap into this source energy, you don't have to, maybe it's a pathway for many of us, but it's not where it ends.

Yeah, and I, I, I did what he's missing. I think it's, I think I did. I think it's just because I've been on this path for so long. of being just so humble and obedient to this energy, to God, that,  like, like you said, it's just the air I breathe now. It's the app running in the background. It is my life. But that doesn't mean I wasn't doing all those things along the way.

I think those things can help us get into the practice of it. If you're going from never doing it,  to all of a sudden trying to learn it, right? Right. You need those tools. They're tools to get you into the practice. They're tools to help you understand, Oh, like I can feel this certain energy when I'm with the crystal, or I can feel the certain energy if I'm at a healing ceremony.

But as you integrate it, then you don't need those little touch points.  Cause that feeling, you know how to access that feeling, uh, more readily when you want. And I think for me, since I have really gotten it, gotten into this, like, I really just call it that vow of obedience since that happened. I mean, it's just like, you know,  all the time. 

It's awesome. It's just so freeing. It's as a, as a rebel, I'm like, Oh, this is so freeing and wonderful.  It feels like surfing to me. I don't surf, but what I would imagine just like riding that wave, like being in  the toggling of the balance and just responding to what the moment requires and is asking of you.

Um, and then. That freedom, the freedom of letting go and then just enjoying the journey without having to be so controlled and contrived about where it is that you're going and when and what time. Well, see, I think it's the letting go piece that's very, very, very, very, very hard. It's, you talked about the doing and the ritual and all of that, and it's very much just like doing energy.

And I think that we are all born onto a planet where we have been told over and over again for so long that like, Doing I mean, not so we didn't start this way. I think capitalism probably is when things started shifting, right? The industrial revolution, but like doing all the time hustling. And like, we celebrated this like hustle culture for so long.

And I think maybe it was the pandemic that made everybody realize. Wait a second. This whole culture is what made us really, really sick. Yeah. We're all going to sit in our house and make sourdough and make a coffee,  you know, reassess our values and what we're doing in our life. Because I think when you're so conditioned for your energy to constantly being doing mode, being mode is so uncomfortable.

I work with this with my clients all the time. We're like doing nothing. I'm using air quotes because you're never doing nothing. There's stuff happening all the time, but. We're so conditioned to the feeling of action to feel like, and that's so, that goes so deep because it's so tied to self worth, it's so tied to feeling accepted, so tied to, you know, feeling like you're good enough, all those things, right?

And it's like, when you can learn to surrender. And surrender to being, surrender to, um, just knowing that like not always actively doing stuff, but being a vessel for receiving is also like a really big part of this process. I think that we're talking about huge, huge part. And, um, it's interesting too, that you brought in the pandemic because I, the pandemic was such medicine.

You got what you needed, not what you wanted.  Yeah. Um, I want to.  Because two ideas popped in for me when you were talking about this.  It was the story that I know about your health situation when you were full on in the hustle  phase versus  the idea of the pandemic and having a pandemic baby, no less.  And whatever the pandemic medicine was for you in the stillness.

I put stillness in quotes because having a baby is not still it's anything but, but what can you say about the juxtaposition of those two moments? Thank you. Yeah, so for context, what Sylvia is talking about is, um, to get to pull even further back, I would say, I understand what this hostile culture is all about, because like.

I mean, Asian American parenting, like immigrant, let's say immigrant parenting, especially from Asians is like, you know, like my dad being like, Oh, you want to be a teacher? How cute. Let's go be a professor at Princeton. Right. That was so ingrained into me. from the moment I was born. Like, I used to say I came out of the womb as a workaholic.

I got so much of my self worth and validation from being perfect, from overachieving,  from getting amazing grades, from getting all the awards, all of that. And so I'm bringing I don't know why you're talking about grace. It's so weird. Right? Like perfect overachieving straight A student. Now taking that with me as a photographer, all of that came along with me.

So when I was in my shine pet photo stage, I'm talking like I was chasing, not even realize I'm doing it. Like that's just my, that's just the water I swam in and the model that I had and the way I operated in my entire life. Why would it be any different if I'm not bringing that to a business? And I'll be honest, that energy.

Help me a lot. What I tell my clients, though, is that things work until they stop working. And so I reached my stop working point when I continued to work like that after I had my first kid. And in 2017, he is now four years old. And it's almost like motherhood made me like double down on that energy.

Because I'm like, like, Oh, having a kid's not going to change any of this. I can still do it. All right. Yeah. Like I, women can have it all. Like, what are you talking about? Right. And in  2017, I had like two back to back photo shoots. I was so sick for both of them. I couldn't like, honestly, would you have a photo shoot scheduled?

You can't. Cancel it. This isn't like me telling you, Sylvia, I'm sorry. I can't go to your house on the weekend for a shoot. These were like a lot of money on the line, big photo shoots with clients. And so I just like drugged myself up. Yeah. These are commercial clients. I drugged myself up. Um, and I got through it.

And  on the way home from one of the shoots, I was on the 101 freeway of Los Angeles, which is a major highway. And I felt like I was going to pass out. And I could have easily crashed the car. I just was so woozy. I kept like blacking out. And I was like, I need to just like pull over. I need, and so I pulled over.

And um, I went into a parking garage. The guys were like, what is wrong with you? Cause I didn't even talk. I couldn't talk by that point. I thought I was having a heart attack. Um, and so I ended up going to the ER and I remember I'm in the ER and the first thought I had was,  Wait a second. How am I gonna return this laptop to the digitech because I think he needs it on another photo shoot tomorrow.

It wasn't like  It wasn't like am I okay? Yeah, like what the hell just how what's wrong with me? Am I having a heart attack? Like my mind is like jumping into like problem solving mode for work.  I think that  As I'm saying this story, I wonder if like the people listening can reflect on when we have these kinds of moments in life.

Because I really think when we have moments like this, it's an opportunity to shift what the heck you're doing with your life.  And like, it could have been, again, this moment where I just kept going the way I was going, like, but I, I was like, okay, no, no, no, like, this is a wake up call.  This is a red flag wake up call moment, because the next time this happens, maybe I will crash.

Maybe something even worse will happen. And so that's when I changed everything. I think this is when I fired my agent cause I didn't want to work with her anymore cause she was pushing me way too much to do stuff. I didn't even want to do, um, I decided to just not even work with clients. I think I even said I'm not a commercial photographer anymore because I hated the clients that were coming to me.

Um, I started like really doubling down into like, just I'm going to be an artist and be an artist and do what I want, work at my own pace. Um, I really intentionally slowed down. This is me getting out of my workaholic doing mode and learning how to slow down and get into my being mode. And so it's interesting that this happened around 2017,  because now by the time the pandemic rolls around,  I'm much more comfortable with this energy of being and I took, um, I had a pandemic baby like you.

I was pregnant. What's interesting though is production and the pandemic completely stopped. Nobody was allowed to be on set. Nobody was allowed to shoot anymore. So it wasn't just me that wasn't working. It was like the whole world in my industry wasn't working along with many other people. And I got to just really enjoy the sweetness of being pregnant.

Yeah. And I took a year long maternity leave and I got to really enjoy the sweetness of that. Um, and I think that, I think now, wow, if I hadn't had that come to Jesus moment where I had those years of practicing the slowing down, but what my life have looked at, like, if I got into the pandemic and was forced to slow down, like I probably would have been crawling out of my skin.

Yeah. I probably would have felt really. Worthless because so much of that healing and slowing down was me untangling my identity and self worth from my doing and my working and my overachieving and learning to love myself because so many, especially create, I mean, so many of us, but I'm just speak to creatives is like so many of us are so tied to the things we create. 

How well they're received, how well they do, and we only feel good if we're busy working, you know? Oh, how you doing? I'm so busy. It's like, it sounds like you're complaining, but really you're broadcasting. I'm wanted. People want me, you know? So I got to really like heal from all of that.  That's so cool. And I almost. 

I feel like what an interesting journey because we've bookended the hustle culture years and then the pandemic sweetness of having the family life and the ease with which you're able to sink into it. But I know in the middle, you also were told by your guides to start a whole podcast. And that was oh, oh my gosh.

Yeah. Okay. That started actually before the pandemic that started. Okay. So thanks for bringing this up. I remember  you and I were in your house one day. Yeah.  And we're like, this is like 2018. We're like,  what are we supposed to do? And I terrified,  terrified. And I said, I declared something that sounded so ridiculous.

I was like, I want to be like Oprah and Elizabeth Gilbert, but like the Asian version, me doing it.  Um, in 2019,  I kept getting this urge to like help people on more of like a direct level. Cause I always knew I was helping people through my photography. Like you feel good when you see cute animals. And I kept hearing like, This call to, no, like help people more directly and I didn't know what that was.

And then when I finally got podcast, I started crying because I knew that was right, yet so terrifying at the same time. I'm sure you went through this when you were starting your podcast.  It's scary. It's always scary.  It's scary. It's  scary when you get confronted with this thing that you know you have to do and that resistance comes up.

It's a scary up level. It is an up level. And having the courage to walk through that fear, that's part of the journey. It's part of the process. So yeah, I ended up starting the podcast called Creativity School in 2019. And, um, I've had to, this is a whole other thing. This could be a three hour podcast, girl.

Because I didn't have to come back to, I mean, related to, you know, your question about the pandemic, it's like  the way I'm building everything now as a mom of two and really learning how to work in less resistance and more flow. Is like things aren't going to go in my timing. And the reason why I say this is because building a business when you got two kids, way different than building a business when you have zero kids.

And I have done it both ways now. Cause when I built shine, pet photos, I had zero kids. Now I'm trying to do this thing. thing. And I got to, and it's so different. It's so different because when you don't have any kids, you can get into that masculine doing energy and no one's going to stop you. When you have kids, you got to learn when to go and when to pause.

It's like your children are really forcing you to get into a cycle. Maybe it's like a cycle of nature or something. And you got to work with that, um, with as least suffering as possible, which for me, as somebody who was always like, has this urge to create, create, create. And I, it's just, it's been learning to slow down and go with that.

And so I started this podcast, it did gangbusters, but life makes me stop. So I have been, I was April. It's almost one year since I've been in a hiatus of it because of my children and because of what this. My home life is demanding of me and I hope I can get back to it one day, but I'm surrendering.

There's that word. I'm surrendering to when the time will be right for me to get back to it. I had to stop because of my kiddos.  I know it sounds like one sentence.  And also, is surrendering easier for you now? Is it still a process for you now? What does surrendering actually look like for you?  So surrendering now is definitely a lot easier because I think the thing that makes surrender  easier to do is trust.

I trust. That I'm being put into the cycle of rest and holding back and incubation because this is preparing me for whatever lies ahead. And  I think this whole journey is just about building that trust muscle building. It's a connection. If I could say, I just think that we're not doing all this alone. 

We are in relationship with source.  That's exactly right. We are co creating. It's a relationship. With Source. Yes. It's a relationship and you're not doing this by yourself. And so when you can trust that relationship as much as you trust your best friend, your spouse, whoever it is that you can lean on as a human being and have that kind of relationship with this unknown force in your life that is so loving and is just guiding you to your  Life on this planet in this life that to me makes surrender so much easier It's that trust and connection and all of it comes down to love  Yeah,  and it's something that I feel like you've you've built With the universe you've, because I'm going back to the conversation about trust in, in tangible terms, like Brene Brown talks about it.

Have you heard her anatomy of trust talk?  She has a whole acronym that's braving and I'm totally blanking on what they stand for, but she breaks down the anatomy of trust and she talks about how it's built over time. And she talks about how there's requirements to build trust. And if you look at trust  and the universe. 

As a relationship, just like any other relationship, it really gets so  simple. It gets really tangible because we like, well, not we like, we normally talk about spirituality in the universe as this, like,  intangible nebulous thing. But if we really take the time and the effort to try to break it down and help our mind understanding, Understand it, even in terms of human relationship, all of a sudden it gets that much easier  because you had all of those experiences with your dad, with your intuition, with your career,  with your family, building your family and how everything went and the timeline of how everything worked out. 

You are now  currently in the state of surrender because you can trust.  Enough to surrender because absolutely tangible evidence in the experience to back it up.  Yeah. Yes, absolutely. I want to touch on two things with that. That's so beautifully said when you said about Brene Brown's acronym and you were talking about how trust, um, takes time, like when you're building a relationship with something, it takes time.

Um, And I had said it's a trust in this relationship I have with this, with this  unseen force.  But I think what you, how you sort of ended this all is it really starts with being able to trust yourself. Yes. Bingo.  Right. You got to trust the nudges and trust yourself. And then like you said, this is something I do with my clients as well.

It's like. Cause all of them, they're all coming to me and they need to learn to trust themselves. I'm like, you are so much more intuitive than you even give yourself credit for. I want you to now, your homework is to look at your life and write down a list of all the times you trusted yourself and what the outcome of that was.

Because I am willing to bet that there are so many instances of that where you can find that tangible evidence that Sylvia, you were just talking about and then show your brain, Oh, wait a second. I can trust myself. Trusting myself isn't this scary, deep dive into the dark where terrible things happen.

Look, I trusted myself and X, Y, Z times. And this amazing thing resulted from it. And when people do that, they blow their own minds.  They really do. I know that's so fun to be just a witness for that moment of like, you're blowing your own minds of your own wisdom, your own, you know, intuitive, intuitive, you know, ability.

And it's just so  powerful to be  In the audience for that, because it is really so affirming for both, right? Like, yes, we all have this ability. There is really nothing special about you or me and that we're  having access to all of these extra things.  It's everyone, everyone can do it. And it's so cool that we get to just.

Affirm that every single day with every single person that we come into contact with. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that this word evidence is really powerful because  what I find happens, it's like, it's like we are both human and spirit. And when you're on this path, what you're doing is you're learning to integrate your soul and your spirit into your humanness.

You're both. You're not. one or the other. You're both. And this path is to learn to integrate the two, right? And so oftentimes we get into our spiritual self, the nudge, the intuitiveness. And what happens is our human self kicks in. It's the brain that kicks in. So your brain will jump in. And I like to warn everybody ahead of time, when you get the nudge that for a second, it feels so good.

You're like, yes, Immediately after your brain is going to kick in and tell you all the reasons why that is the dumbest idea you've ever heard and it's stupid and you shouldn't do it, only the worst is going to happen from it. So just don't do it because it's the goal of your brain is to keep you safe.

So we have these beautiful brains. that one to keep us safe. How does it keep us safe? It keeps us on the predictable and known path. And so the external world loves to tell us what the predictable and unknown path is. Our parents love to tell us, our schools love to tell us. We're so structured and conditioned into what the predictable and known path is.

Your soul is not really interested in that. You broke up for a second. I'm just going to keep talking. Your soul wants to take you to your highest and your best, right? And so you have to know that your brain is going to jump in and do what it wants to do. And what I like to tell people is like, your brain is like a really cute, sweet puppy.

And you just need to potty train it. You just need to train your brain very lovingly, right? And let it know it's going to be okay. I understand you want to, you're telling me this is scary, but I got it. My soul, my spirit, my heart, I got it. knows what's right. And so I'm going to trust and remember all those times where I did this before and things worked out.

This is just going to be another one of those times. This is like a really conscious reprogramming of the way your brain works because literally like your brain jumping in and doing that is a neural pathway. That's been, it's like a train track that's been laid down in your brain and it's a habit. So it's like you're, you're, Your spirit kicks in and then by habit, without you even thinking, your brain is going to kick in and go on that train track.

You got to just reprogram it. So you have to notice when it's happening and then help re, help it rewire through repetition, through consistency, through evidence to show your brain, it's okay. I got this. Amazing things will happen from it.  Exactly. Exactly. And it's just, it's so hard because it's so subconscious.

It's so automatic. And it's, it's not easy to a notice that it's happening because if you're unconscious to it, by definition, you don't know that it's happening. But I think as we go through the whole journey in the process, we start to notice it and then we're able to put space between that and the response.

And then it just, we're able to almost slow down time in that sense, right? Like. Instead of a boom, boom, it just, it slows down and it's almost like we could, whoops, we could play with it almost like putty or slime. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Cause you're slowing down out. Excuse me. You're slowing down out of like the primal reaction. 

Sorry.  Water break.  I'm good. I'm good.  Cool. Thank you though.  Uh, no dying on the podcast. Um,  um, what were we talking about? We're slowing down time. We're slowing down the response. Like putty. Not reacting. So, okay. So now that we're talking about. Noticing the subconscious responses, the automatic responses, and being able to get into the driver's seat of them and starting to slow everything down.

Can you give us an example of  a struggle that you've had to implement that with?  What, where was the lesson for you?  Oh my gosh. I think, um, for me showing up on social media as my fullest self has been the thing I've been working on for the last three years because again, I took a vow of obedience. So, um. 

I started a photo series in 2019. Um, that is so different than what I'm normally known for. Like I'm known for like really colorful images, like literally will make you laugh out loud. Cause they're funny or they're cute. And I started this photo series where they're like black and white. Dead on portraits of dogs were like, I'm telling you, stare into their eyes, feel your feels, channel the messages you're getting from them, breathe, and it was so, for me at the time, different than anything I was doing.

I had not step forward as an Akashic record reader. So I'm just, I just felt like this work was coming so out of left field and people are going to be like,  WTF, Grace has gone off the deep end. Um, and I started sharing it and it made me so deeply uncomfortable. I felt so naked and it's just been like this process ever since then of, okay, you thought that was scary, Grace.

Well, no, now you have to like, start making videos about how you're an Akashic record reader. Oh, you thought that was scary. Just like, like continuously. Growing on social media because  I was known I have been known on Instagram for so long as just this one thing again. I put myself in this box. I'm the dog photographer and by 2021, it started feeling so uncomfortable.

Like I'm like, I'm not even this person anymore. Like, yes, I love dogs, but the person that I was when I started this business when I was 28 is not the person that I met I am now as a mom of two kids.  And so this, this identity of this page just didn't.  I don't feel like me anymore. And so just this call to just be yourself, keep sharing your wisdom, keep sharing what it is you want to share.

That's been, I've been working on that a lot and it's been getting easier and easier as time has gone on because it's been three years. So I've been showing up more on video. I hate being on video. Um, so. Like I hate being on video. I'm a photographer. I hide behind the camera, right? And it's just  practicing this muscle of discomfort and breaking through it.

Cause I know, I know at this point,  this resistance is there because  I'm meant to be myself in every way. And I got to do it, even though it makes me so uncomfortable,  man. Well, I, I know I was a witness for that moment when you were thinking about the concept for a healer photo series, which is what it was called, right?

And it's, it's  from my perspective, a bit of your coming out story. Right, because before that it was, you are a photographer, you are in the commercial advertising industry, you know, and all of a sudden you have this whole other life that you didn't really acknowledge up until then. And all of a sudden you were being asked to step into your role as a healer  and  what a beautiful coming out.

It has been.  Thank you. Yeah. You have been witness to, I mean, I think we've both been witness to each other's transformation and coming out in all sorts of ways. Right. And  we've both, it's just been constant, constant. And even it's funny you say the word healer now because  I don't even, I, I, my guide said you have to take a break from coaching in the fall because my kids have been getting sick nonstop.

It's, it's related to why I had to stop the podcast. And it started with the podcast. I had to stop it. And in the fall, I had to stop the coaching because I just, it's unsustainable. And I don't even think I'm a coach anymore because I've continued to evolve and grow since then. And I can really see. That I'm moving more into energy healer territory where it's less mental plane, talking, coaching.

It's almost like therapy kind of stuff and moving more into just, let me just move your energy and do it. Cause it's a lot quicker.  I love that.  I giggle because it's such a, it's such a different way of doing things. And if you had said even, even five years ago, even 10 years ago to ourselves, Oh, hi, this is what you're going to be doing.

This is what. It's going to look like, I think we would have laughed in our own face a little bit, like. Absolutely. But I think this is why, this is what's coming to mind right now, the order of operations is so important and it's so important to honor that  because I think as humans, again, our brains jump in.

It's like, you're not going fast enough. Or what are you doing, Grace? Your podcast was doing gangbusters and you just stopped. Like, it doesn't matter if your kids are sick and all this stuff is happening in your house. You better get going on that. Or wait, wait, you're going to like stop coaching? Like you, you, you were building this thing and you have to quit.

It's the bro business. Right. But see, here's what I can see now. How committed are you? Yeah. Right. All that stuff. You got to keep pushing no matter what at the cost to your health. But I can see the order of operations. I needed to do the coaching first.  To even get used to speaking, speaking my thoughts, right?

I needed to do the Akashic record reading to even know that I have this ability to connect and channel, right? I had to do the coaching to know that I can work with people on this level one to one. And it was through the coaching that it evolved into me energy healing, because I got certified in hypnosis.

So I'm putting people into hypnosis and moving their energy around. And so, This is what I mean by the order of operations. Like when you're, if we're taking a step back to when you and I were in your house in Burbank talking about these things and we were like, you are gonna be an intuitive healer helping tons of people having a podcast.

You'd be like WTF, and it's like Grace. You're gonna be an energy healer moving people's energy around and doing all these things. We would've been like, what the heck? But it's the order of operations, each step leading to the next that allows like. Us to be able to do it without, uh,  pooping our pants,  dying,  equal, same thing.

You're like, heck no universe. No, I'm not doing that. We would absolutely not want to get out of bed. We would just run away and call it a day. Bye. Nevermind. Like screw that. No, I'm not doing that. That's exactly it. That's exactly it. And I love that you used order of operations because it reminds me of how we both have an upbringing that is very. 

STEM based, it's, you know, science, math, technology, engineering, mind. We have this logical, critical background  that we were given by our parents.  Which is such a gift because look at us now, we can speak both languages. We can speak the language of intuition. We can speak the language of logic and science and math, and we know how to bridge the gap. 

And we know how to also know that we are in a grounded spot in between.  Yes. And I think this is, again, why no experience goes wasted. I had so many people tell me, Oh my god, isn't it such a waste for you to have studied for four years and get a biology degree and just go to art school? And even at the time, I was like, This again, unawakened, but at the time, I said, It's not a waste at all.

Because that taught me so much about discipline and getting out what I put in. And I absolutely use that in art school, right? And so I think it's order of operations. No experience goes wasted. Every experience you have builds into the next. Yeah. Even if you have no idea how those pieces work together.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.  That's so cool. Well, I want to wrap up, but I have three more questions for you. Okay. Let's go.  Okay. We're going to start by dropping in. So let's just, let's take three deep breaths together just to get out of our mind a little bit. If 

you're listening, feel free to join in, Take a deep breath in.  And out.  Really get centered into this present moment. We're dropping in and 

out.  From this space, we have greater awareness. Everything is slowed down.  We have all our senses turned on.  Our guides are always there, but if we're intentionally connecting into their wisdom, it just, we can hear it and receive it a little bit more clearly. So grace, my first question from this space is. 

From where you are and what you know now,  can you bring forward a past version of you  that needed your current wisdom?  And what time travel message can you send to them? What transmission would you have?  Just be yourself and don't be afraid to shine. There's that word.  Yeah. Don't be afraid to shine. I think,  um,  when you're Asian American in this country, you feel very invisible,  very, very invisible.

And I think I felt that as a child, I mean, even, even as adults, we still feel that. And I think invisibility gives you safety too. And so shining is the complete opposite of that. So don't be afraid to shine. 

Moving the ticker, the time  to the version of you on your very last day on this planet in full gratitude for your whole experience. 

What message would that version of you have for today's grace? 

I just hear her saying, well done you. 

That's all she says. Well done, you will take it. I'll take it. We did it. I love it.  And then  coming out a little bit, coming back to our body.  Is there a book or an experience or a. Some kind of resource that you would say changed your life, like grace before this  and grace after this. 

I  read so many books.  It's hard for me to even try to remember back to maybe one that was transformative.  Early on. Uh, let's ask your guides to drop in one 

there. What they're saying is signs. It's not an early memory one, but it's one I read recently and it's the one that I have. I feel like Oprah, like if I could give this book to everybody I meet, I would give it to them because I think,  I think this book is Laurel and Jackson. What I love about this book is that she does a really great job explaining how.

communicating with the universe works, which, and she does it just very succinctly. Her book is so easy to read. Um, that's why I just love what the educational aspect of it, but then I think what makes it extra, extra, extra powerful, or the story she's sharing about her experience as a medium.  I think the two working together is something so powerful happening.

And I, I, I went to her event after I finished reading the book and I can verify that she is just such. an incredible, lovely, amazing person. So this work is coming so purely from somebody's heart and positive good intention. So if you have not read that book yet, I highly recommend it because I've been talking about this book on Instagram like for months now.

And I've had so many people come back to me and be like, that book was just amazing. I was crying. It changed my life. Like, thank you. So go read that book if you haven't.  It's such a good book. It really is the concept of a door opener for me to where we have somebody we love and trust in a door and admire so much that we have a, a 3d human life connection to  go ahead of us through that door, right?

On the other side. And having that. Tangible trusted connection is almost a door opener in a way to invite us to explore that side of ourselves, that side of the universe.  And acknowledge that there is so much more than just this 3D experience and having those tangible signs.  It's like shorthand, it's like the universe's validation and confirmation that we're not making it up.

We don't need to gaslight ourselves. We can trust the things that we see, hear, feel and know.  And here's why, and here's how, and here's tangible evidence. That is so much more to us, to life, to the universe, to our entire experience.  So all I can say, I totally agree. I love this book so much and I love our versions of our real life signs that we pick up on every day. 

Yes. And to add on to what you just shared, her book is what, because, you know, we were talking so much about really being able to trust that connection that, you know, source is so loving. God is so loving. And what's the highest and best for us on this, on this earth experience, that book really Like, it's like, you already know this, but reading the book made me really see how much, it's not just God, it's all those guides, past family members or angels, all of them are all working on our behalf to help us have,  you know, the best experience that we can have to have our souls live in our bodies on earth here.

And it was that book that made me realize how much my dad has been helping me in this. Oh. To put a bow on all of this. Oh. Yeah. Full circle. Because I spoke at the beginning of this that I was born with this very rebellious spirit. I'm a life path five. Five is the, that's like the spiritual rebel. So I've, for the longest time, I just, I just attributed it to, I'm rebellious, I'm just going to do what I want.

I don't care what you have to say about it. I believe in my own inner knowing more than what the external world is telling me. That book is really what made me realize, Oh my God, my dad had so much to do with this. It had not even occurred to me. And I was sitting at a park one day, reflecting on this book and my dad dropped in.

And it was almost like I was having this like, Christopher Nolan movie experience, where like in one second, I had, My entire life flashed before my eyes of all the things that he had been involved in helping me with. And I was like, Oh my God, mind blown. I can't believe this.  So yeah, that book is amazing. 

Oh, just, I need a moment just to acknowledge that moment. Like that download of.  understanding and context that he gifted to you in that moment. Yeah, it was powerful. I had no idea. It's like amazing how you can connect dots. Like certain books, certain content, certain things just help you connect dots.

That book really helped me fill in so many gaps of my own understanding. One last question just related to that moment. Yeah. Did that download come in a time that you needed it?  Yes. Absolutely. Yes. Yeah. Cause uh, um,  this is a whole other episode, but my, my, my dog was almost 17 years old and she had passed away.

Um, my father, it coincided in the same month as my father's 30th anniversary passing. This was on February, just so happens that. Um, I'm recommending Laura Lynn Books Jackson, Laura Lynn Jackson's book to my clients for the last two years. I had never read it myself, but it just kept coming in through my guides.

Tell them to read this book. All the clients that come to me where their loved one comes through at the very top with a very strong message for them, every single one of them, I'm like, go read this book. I never read it for myself. But apparently I had downloaded it sometime at the beginning of December and forgot about it.

And like,  at the end of December,  I'm in an Airbnb in Arizona, and I'm lying on the bed staring up at the ceiling fan. And it just starts spinning by itself. And I'm like, WTF, there's a ghost in this Airbnb? Like, what is happening?  But then I started feeling into the energy and I was like, I don't think it's a ghost.

I'm not scared. And I, I didn't know what it was when I woke up the next morning. I was like, I think that was my dad trying to get my attention. Oh shoot, I have this book signs. I need to read it.  So, I'm reading it all of January, and that's when it hits me, wait a second, his anniversary of his 30 years since he passed to the other side is in February.

So this is like all happening month by month by month. And it was like, you should, you need to really reflect on what this has been. I'm going to start crying, um, because I think 30 is a very significant number, even 20.  I was not a mom yet.  So 30 was so significant for me to think back on my whole life and being a mom and my kids. 

So it was in that moment of sitting there reflecting on all of this when that dropped in. Sorry. Ah,  what a beautiful hug.  What a beautiful hug your dad gave you in that moment.  He's awesome.  He's really awesome. He comes through in like every sort of  like reading I have with people. He keeps through. Okay.

I had my very first animal communication session back in like 2009.  And he came through in that. It was like my first time experiencing him. He came through and he comes through anytime he gets a chance to. So he's very cool. And yeah, he's proud of me. Of course he is. And then you messaged me about the fan incident.

I think I said, he's your biggest fan. Yes. Yes. Yes. Literally. I love that. I loved when you said that. I was like, of course, because.  I communicate with him and I just get, he, he's just so proud of me because of  what I have been able to overcome in this life to get to where I am today. And I've been able to do things in this life that he didn't get the chance to.

Yeah.  Yeah. You're representing and honoring him well with your life and what a beautiful  gift you are to each other.  Thank you. All right. I'm going to go cry now. Ah! Thank you for this amazing talk. I love that you're doing this podcast. It's amazing. Thank you for being there every step of the way, my spiritual running partner. 

Well done. Well done, you.  Well done, you. Oh, that's going to get me too. All right. Seriously, I'm going to just go cry for an hour after this. Okay. All right. Okay. So Grace, thank you. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. I'm going to have you on again, obviously, because there's always more and more to talk about.

I  love you. Love you. I'm so proud of you.  Ditto, friend. Ditto, friend. Ditto, friend. Ditto, friend.